Edward Burns: More Independent than Ever
Edward Burns has lived the dream of most young filmmakers. He got into the film business by working as a production assistant, and then while working behind the scenes for others, he began writing, producing, directing and starring in the award winning “The Brothers McMullen”. Since then he has become known for his outstanding independent films like “She’s the One”, “Sidewalks of New York”, and “Nice Guy Johnny” created using remarkably low budgets and non-traditional distribution methods. He came by the SiriusXM studios this week to talk with Ron Bennington about his newest film, “Newlyweds.” Below are a few excerpts from that interview.
Ron Bennington: I hear you had a weird way of finding some of the music for your new movie.
Edward Burns: Yeah, a couple of years ago I started using twitter. A good friend of mine who is like the Indie film guru, a guy named Ted Hope, said, as it became harder to find your audience as an Indie film maker he said, you’ve got to go on twitter, and you’ve got to find 5,000 true fans, and have a meaningful dialogue with them. And you’re going to see, they’re going to get out there and they’re going to fight your fights for you and they’re going to help spread the word when you’ve got that little movie that has no marketing dollars. So, they did a great job for me when I was promoting my last film, Nice Guy Johnny. So as I was working on this new film, Newlyweds, I tweeted out to them on a number of things, but one of the things was a song contest. I said, look, we’re looking for an unknown artist, who isn’t signed to any label. Send us your music and we’ll put it in the film, as a way to say thanks for all the great stuff you’ve done for me. And a guy named Pat McCormack, his tune won, and we flew him down for the premier at Tribeca, which is a cool thing. Got to hang with him, and the guy’s 21 years old. [editor’s note: give the song, Ovenbird, a listen here.]
Ron Bennington: So all of your followers were kind of following along as you were writing this, as you were directing, editing, everybody knew what you were doing. Kevin Smith kind of works in a way, particularly in this last film that he did, where he’s bypassed the traditional ways of doing stuff, and you guys were both those 90s independent film makers and both still saying independent.
Edward Burns: Well we both make our own sort of personal films. And I think what we probably both discovered is– two things. One, the minute someone writes you a check, or you’re asking someone for money all of a sudden you have a partner and collaborator, and they’re going to insist on some say over you finished product. Depending on who that is, sometimes they change the title, they’re going to tell you who you can cast, they’re going to change the dialogue, change the ending. And for me its really been about getting away from that and having full creative control. So we figured out ways to make our films on these micro budgets. That also means, we own the film. And like the music biz, you always hear, never give up the copyright. Well we don’t have to give up the copyright anymore, because what we’ve done is, we don’t sell the movie for theatrical distribution. Kind of like Kevin experimented with the tour, and the VOD and I think he did a handful of theatrical dates. Last year, with Nice Guy Johnny, we just went out across all digital platforms. No theatrical at all. We didn’t spend any money marketing the film, it was all about a viral campaign; engaging on social media and twitter. It’s not a million dollar business but the movie made a real solid six figures. So we thought, alright that experiment worked. And that movie we made for $125,000. So this film Newlyweds, we said, lets just do it again. So you get to make the movie you want to make with no interference. You get to release it digitally. And there is real money out there. And that’s the objective isn’t it? To do the thing you love to do, not have anybody in your face making changes, and also make enough money so that you can make a living and hopefully make the next movie.
Ron Bennington: And the thing is, it’s a good looking film too. It looks great and it’s shot in a part of town– Tribeca– not everybody shoots there, and yet it’s a part of New York that’s so stunningly great looking So you’ve done it on a budget, but it’s not four people locked in a room. You’re moving, you’re getting all different kinds of scenes.
Edward Burns: We shot the film on a Canon 5D which is a consumer model SLR camera. My DP and I had heard about this camera, and we thought, alright we should play with this new technology. We had the script written, he and I went on the train from Tribeca up to 34th street to B&H, buy the camera for $2800 dollars. Take the train back downtown, I call a buddy of mine who owns a gym, and my character plays a trainer. I said look, we’re going to come by the gym to test shoot a scene. No lights, just the DP and I. I did the sound by just putting a microphone on myself and the recording device in my pocket. And we shot a half of a phone conversation. We take it back to the editing room which is just a computer with Final Cut on it, put the flash card in, look at the footage and the scene looked great. We said, alright, let’s make a movie like this. And that scene ended up in the finished film.
Ron Bennington: And because you’ve got the dialogue to hold the people.
Edward Burns: It’s the thing that I was always attracted to as a kid in film school. I always fell in love with those smaller movies.My thing is – I look at the world that I know, hold a mirror up to it, reflect it back honestly with some humor, without pretension.You’re never going to find the biggest audience with those kind of films, but there’s enough of an audience.
Ron Bennington: It is the most relatable thing. Because most of us have never seen a car chase or a gun fight and yet we go to the movies, and we’re seeing shit like that all the time. But you can sit there, and in the film when your sister comes over, everybody has been on both sides of that relationship. You’ve been the asshole taking advantage, and you’ve been taken advantage of. And that to me, is what that whole experience becomes about.
Edward Burns: Well that was sort of the goal. How do you tell these honest stories that feel like the people you know. And part of the thing that I did when I was writing this thing– when I had the initial idea I tweeted it out to my followers. And I said, look, it’s going to be about this newly wedded couple. And in the first couple of months the shit is really going to hit the fan, and they’re going to be forced to actually get to know one another. So I said, what’s something that happened within the first couple of months in your marriages where you had your first big fight. And I’d say 9 out of 10 people tweeted back, [things like] oh my crazy brother crashed on our couch and wouldn’t leave. So when I heard those stories about family– that’s when I decided to link all these characters together and have it interwoven.
Ron Bennington: We don’t even know why we put up with that from family.
Edward Burns: The thing that’s interesting about the family issue is, you treat your siblings and your family members very differently than you would treat your friends. What was interesting with these characters was that sense of allegiance. My character, this guy Buzzy, he’s got this wife that he really loves, and then he’s got this sister that he really doesn’t even know and yet he finds himself lying on her behalf, taking her side in these fights, and who knows why? Instinctually sometimes, that blood is thicker than water thing, you go there. And I don’t know if it’s even a rational thought or if it’s more a primal thing.
Ron Bennington: And you’ve been working through these themes since the mid nineties. Do you feel like you know more about this stuff than you did?
Edward Burns: I don’t think so. I’ve never tried to preach in any films. While certainly I’ll throw my own point of view in there, when I’m writing a script, whether I’m at a kids birthday party or a dinner party with friends, I’ll direct the conversation to the thing I’m writing about and I’m just constantly taking notes on everyone’s different point of view. And that’s all that I’ve ever tried to do. This is how everyone is thinking and feeling and you draw your own conclusions about what path is the right one for you. Or what I love, is when people come up to me and say, I think I was every one of those characters in your film at one point in my life.
Ron Bennington: And we probably don’t learn from it. It’s just part of this dance– this whole thing about being a human being. And I think that you do that with your films.
Edward Burns: Well thank you. The challenge has been, how do you continue to do this over fifteen years and make money and stay afloat in a very competitive business given that these aren’t the type of films that really break out and make a lot of money. The thing that I’ve always been most interested in are those little tiny connections or relationships. It’s always been about– the most important things in your life, usually are your family and your friends. And that’s all that I’ve ever tried to explore. And there are endless stories– endless situations. So for me it’s been a lot of fun to keep exploring that, and there’s not a ton of film makers out there doing it.
Ron Bennington: Thanks so much for stopping in. Newlyweds is available on demand, or you can see it on Itunes or amazon, and the twitter is @edward_burns.
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You can hear this interview in its entirety exclusively on SiriusXM satellite radio. Not yet a subscriber? Click here to get a free trial subscription.
Follow Edward on twitter @edward_burns or on his website.
